As much as I really hate to ride the whole “OMG DO U HAEV ANIME PRIDE?!” bandwagon, I’d really like to voice my opinion on this subject. Maybe it’ll even spark some ANGRY REPLIES. I should only be so lucky.
I think this whole thing is positively hilarious, especially the reader reactions. But something I’d particularly like to address that I keep seeing in these responses is this, “ANIMU IS A LYFESTYL I DUN CARE IF THERE’S STIGMAS OMG ANIMU IS AWEXOME AND FOR MATURE PPLZ OK ITS NAWT CARTOONS.” attitude.
Look… I understand that you don’t care what anyone thinks. I understand that you’re A FUKKEN OTAKU AND PROUD OF IT^________^. I understand that you want to throw yourself into this hobby “lifestyle” by sinking unhealthy amounts of time and money into it. I understand that you don’t care about any of the social stigmas against anime fans. And I also understand that you are the exact kind of people that gave us this bad reputation in the first place.
Let’s say I’m in a bookstore. I’m just walking around, looking at a book… about golf. A portly, man-smelling dude with khaki shorts and cheap sandals sees what I’m reading and asks me about my interest in golf. “Oh, it’s just a passing curiosity…” I say nonchalantly, a bit apprehensive of the middle-aged manthing in front of me.
BAM. THAT’S WHEN IT HAPPENS. In a flurry of spit and exaggerated hand motions, the man suddenly starts going off about par and 3W clubs and how put-put and married women give serious golfers a bad name.
I’m terrified. I’ve got this crazy person in front of me who seems out of control, and all I want to do is get away. When I try to leave, he just keeps on badgering me. Naturally, I deal a swift kicktotheballs and hightail it out of there.
And I’m not the only person who’s been having trouble with golfers! It’s commonplace! And as more and more people have these kinds of encounters with golfers, stigmas and stereotypes are formed.
Do you see where I’m going here?
If you don’t, I’ll clue you in: it’s not the nondescript anime fans that gave otaku a bad name, it’s fans of the militant, obsessive variety that make us all look like loser fucks. In other words, the people who talk about anime nonstop, balk at you when you don’t care for a series they like, run around screaming BANKAI and RASENGAN, they’re the ones who are the most proud and ~coincidentally~ the ones that make us all look like loser fucks.
There is a time and a place for dead baby jokes. There is a time and a place for golf. And there is a time and a place for anime. Those of you who think it’s a “lifestyle?” There is no lifestyle, just a hobby its niche of LOSERS with no social skills that take it to the point of sick obsession. And for the record, I don’t mean “loser” lovingly like I normally do; in this instance I mean loser to take on its general definition: a complete piece of shit.
I, personally, am not ashamed of being an anime fan. But I don’t bring up my burning passion for golf Higurashi in every conversation with every person I ever talk to. I’ve got interests OTHER than anime, and when someone doesn’t like Saikano or Simoun, I take it like a ~grown-up~ and realize that not everyone likes the same things. Sure, I call my boyfriend “oniichan” as a sick joke, but I don’t tack Japanese honorifics onto the end of everyone’s names. My point is that my interests are diversified. I realize that my niche hobby is not everyone’s cup of tea, and as such, I know when and where it is appropriate to bring up the subject of anime.
You can say that you are proud of being a rabid yaoifag or a Gundam enthusiast, but if you’ve got a crappy attitude and don’t even want to try to improve yourself or take a critical look at what you’re interested in, just what do you have to be proud of? Is it your passion as an otaku, your passion for LelouchxSuzaku, the way you throw yourself into this hobby wholeheartedly?
If that’s all you have to be proud of, I rest my fucking case.
Sorry about only going off about the stigmas fans themselves have created rather than the people who think anime is all tentacle rape and kiddie porn, but I think everyone’s already covered that sufficiently. Plus, I’ve never come across a person who thought anime was solely pornographic in nature, so I can’t say much about it. As far as being ashamed of the actual CARTOONS, if you claim to be an otaku yet say that you’re ashamed because of the actual content of the shows you watch… dude… why are you watching, anyway? No, seriously, I’d really like to know.
And so ends my post. Let the flames begin!
No flames here.
Only the burning passion to say that, you’re fucking awesome.
Good Job with the post. Spoken like a true ambassador from The Institution of Awesome.
Spread the good word. Anime, Fuck Yeah!
I download anime by the gigabyte, have an extensive library of anime DVDs, purchase piles of anime figures, and am an active subscriber to Megami. I lurk on 4chan and spend a lot of my time on various IRC channels filled with like-minded otaku.
At work, you can instantly tell which desk is mine – it’s the one with five OS-tan figures, three HCM-Pro Gundams, and an Ichigo Mashimaro calendar.
And I agree with everything you say. There are so many ‘enthusiasts’ who act like utter fucking morons. They’re the reason why I have never bothered to go to a con, and have very little desire to do so.
It’s fine to be enthusiastic about your hobby, but there is a time and a place to talk about it. It’s fine to talk about it if it comes up in normal conversation, but for god’s sake, don’t beat other people over the head with it. You just make people assume that everyone who watches the stuff is a creepy, immature moron. Then those of us who actually act responsibly have to deal with people’s unwarranted negative perceptions of us.
Good post, I agree with you (right down to not being particularly proud of my nationality). Sadly, it seems that many anime fans are either in (or barely out of) their rebellious teenage years, and thus revel in being different and better than “mundane, ordinary people,” or they have a persecution complex deeply ingrained from the time when they were unpopular in school, and think that being proud of what made them unpopular is the best defense. And of course these people all think that their hobby somehow makes them better than “outsiders.” (A really great article on this: http://www.plausiblydeniable.com/opinion/gsf.html )
I think that even though they’re louder and more annoying, teenagers are the better part of the lot – after all, everything is Serious Business when you’re a teenager, but then you grow up and hopefully learn that there are more important things in life that define you than being ZOMG DIFFERENT. But those people who should know better but are still proud that their whole life revolves around anime… those are the scary ones. Especially when they complain that that “outsiders” look down on them. Gee, I wonder why.
I think there’s nothing wrong with embracing one’s inner geek. I don’t mind cons (though I mainly go to cons to meet friends I wouldn’t see otherwise for various reasons), I acknowledge the fun in cosplaying, etc. etc. Cons are among the “times and places” of having fun with our hobbies. But so many people should learn that being overly enthusiastic about your hobby outside of those times and places doesn’t reflect well neither on them, nor on the fandom in general.
(And don’t get me started on “yaoifags.” See, I like yaoi. But there are so many fucking idiot fans out there that they almost make me feel ashamed of sharing an interest with them.)
“it’s not the nondescript anime fans that gave otaku a bad name, it’s fans of the militant, obsessive variety that make us all look like loser fucks.”
Truest words I’ve heard all day :D
Maybe it’s because I’ve been out of college and been working for a few years, but I don’t get a lot of the social stigma cries in these posts and replies. It makes it seem like the world is infested with otaku trainwrecks. Like is this an actual problem for those normal anime fans still in school or is this just blog drama?
Anyway, most people really just don’t care just as long as you don’t invade their space with it or come off as a zealot. Also, don’t act all embarassed when people find out about your stupid hobby either. Almost every hobby or pasttime is lame when you get down to it, like golf. It’s all in how you carry yourself.
While I agree that the more negative aspects of anime fan culture tends to be the more highlighted in society, I think the nondescript anime fans tend to embellish how bad it is (misery loves company?). The question is though, are the nondescript fans willing to try and take the spotlight away from the insane ones and say that anime fans can be “normal” too?
@Darkshaunz: :O Awesome, thanks!
@Negs: Exactly! Also, conventions are a lot of fun, really, but the problem is that a lot of people going to conventions don’t stop the party once the convention is over.
@kuromitsu: Thanks for pointing me to that article, and I can testify to the lame teenager theory. When I was in high school, the otaku consisted entirely of people who thought being random was SOOOO~ KAWAII^___^ and thought that BOYS KISSING was soooo~ hawt~. Basically, they were a bunch of spineless rejects with awful taste in anime who just tried to make excuses as to why everyone thought they were failures.
I definitely see what you’re saying about teenagers growing up and learning some common sense, but a lot of the people I knew never got out of that whole “omg i watch animu so i am special” mindset. However, I’m one of those people that grew up (although I can honestly say that I was never that bad in the first place), so there’s something to that! :D
Oh, absolutely! Being a geek/nerd/dork is a lot of fun, as are conventions. And you’re exactly right about acting like an idiot outside of cons. It’s cool to cosplay, run around, make references, etc. at conventions, but it’s something that should stay in conventions and among friends and not be continued in places like… say, book stores (which is where I encounter most of these horrible otaku I allude to in my post).
(I know how you feel. Yaoi really isn’t my thing, but I feel bad for the reasonable yaoi fans. It’s bad enough that you’ve got all these obnoxious otaku running around, but the ratio of rational yaoi fans to rabid yaoi fans is just ridiculous. All I can say is be the change you wish to see, and hopefully, one day, things will turn around.)
@Nekonron: Thanks! :3
@super rats: I’m technically not IN school, and even though I’m not one to really go out too much, it’s a pretty big problem where I live. Every time I go to the book store or the local strip mall, I see these teenage girls squealing about yaoi and Inuyasha and these fat NEET guys who ambush me in the manga aisle rambling about how awesome Gundam Seed Destiny is. Trust me, I wouldn’t be making such a big deal out of it if I hadn’t experienced otaku faggotry firsthand and frequently.
It’s really dumb to be embarrassed about liking anime. Most hobbies are lame, like you said, but if you enjoy it, then why should you be embarrassed or ashamed to admit it? I really don’t understand that at all.
@TheBigN: If you’ll read my response to super rats’ comment, you’ll see that I’m really not embellishing much at all. At least, not in my experience. Then again, I live in an area that’s saturated with otaku and I’ve been to my fair share of conventions, so I guess it all depends on personal experience. I’m sure that to someone who’s never encountered a crazy otaku, I probably seem like I’m making a huge deal out of nothing.
I’ve definitely tried that, only to find that it didn’t really work. Like what I said to kuromitsu, at this point, I’m just being the change I’d like to see and leaving it at that. I think by not being obnoxious and showing people that I’m well-rounded and somewhat intelligent before I mention that anime is a hobby of mine, that’s probably the best thing to do.
I guess since I’m older, I’m insulated from the overzealous people you describe when at the bookstore and stuff like that. They must stop their squealing when I step around them in the aisle, whereas they wouldn’t for someone who looks closer to their own age.
The way you go about it is the way I go about it. You know, don’t act like a moron…it’s good policy.
In the country where I live (Czech Republic, EU) people usually have no awarness of anime whatsoever hence no biases and social stigmas cast upon the ones who revel in it. The community here is also relatively insignificant, so randomly meeting one of a fellow kind is highly improbable. Which leads my to the question – Marmot, where are you from? The notion of going to a local bookstore, mentally bracing for the possibility of need to parry attacks of random militant otaku-nerds seems amusing to me^_^
Anyways, as far as your article is concerned; 100% agreed. Anime surely is a wonderful hobby but whe one decides to promote it to a lifestyle of sorts – shit’s gonna hit the fan (if it hasn’t already happened).
As I see it, it’s vital to maintain a couple of another hobbies/interests. Person, who is only well-versed in a very relative narrow subject and blatantly ignored everything beyond that (be it anime or mathematics) would always be perceived as a geek/nerd/weirdo by the society. One might argue that it’s OK as long as the person doesn’t give a damn but I maintain, that this period is usually ephemeral and the day when person will start to look back, evaluating his life thinking what it might have been like had he done this and that … and this shit could very well be accompanied by harsch psychological trauma.
Personally, I don’t know any militant otaku iRL, just spotted some folks who gave me that impression on some discussion forums, which I scarcely read and contribute to. I regret that, nontheless, because getting to know such a specimen would certainly be an enlightening experience for me; especially for such person would give me a great pretense to practise my unbridled sarcasm ^__^ So next time I go to a con (September actually) I’ll be actively seeking for these fellas and try to approach them. Hell, if i managed to lay my hands on a DV cam, I’d actually even try to conduct some interviews ^___^
>>so I guess it all depends on personal experience.
Probably. I know some crazy otaku too, but they all seem smart enough to know when to flaunt it and when not too, so that might have colored my experiences. But I do feel sorry for what you had/have to deal with. :P
I also don’t get all the fuzz about animepride. Maybe it’s because I’m not too deep into it. I’ve just recently came back to anime to find out about a great blogsphere and online community.
However this topic targets what’s happening outside of the computer and so far there is only one place where I meet other otakus. There is this japanese bookstore here in my area (Germany) which holds an purikura photobooth. This store is really popular with otakus and I always encouter cosplayers when I try to do some photos with my gf. I don’t hold a grudge against them eventhough they are quite noisy. They don’t affect my stay in the shop to the extend that I have to feel bothered by them. So I think I can feel lucky that I didn’t encounter any animepride yet.
On my personal attitude towards anime: I’ve grown out of this “I’m prouf of what I do, leave me alone, it’s my life blahblah” crap. Having a social life means interacting with people and adapting to the current situation with carefully posing your position. It’s common sense…
Nicely done!
I’ve been an anime fan for many years now. I’ve always been bothered by retarded otaku types who constantly sport their retarded Naruto merchandise or Bleach gear. I really don’t like it when they claim that ______ is the BEST ANIMU EVARZZ when they haven’t even taken the time to watch much of anything else. I live in Hawaii which is HEAVILY influenced by Japanese culture. There are a fair share of otaku retards here but I don’t think it’s as bad as the mainland or other places where most people only know about anime and nothing else about the culture or anything.
I’m also a fan of JRock and I find retarded JRock fangirls much worse than any retarded anime fan I’ve run into. Honestly because of them I can’t even go on forums or etc for my favorite bands since they’ve invaded it with their infectious squeals and ranting. Same with yaoi unfortunately. I’m sick of those types of fans ruining the experience for those who aren’t like that. And also how most of us get a bad name because of it :/
I think over zealous fandom in general is fucking irritating, but it seems that if you’re also a fan and you’re not a raving lunatic about what you like then it’s even worse. It seriously sucks.
I love it when people say anime is a “lifestyle,” because it just shows how little thought they actually put into the shit they say. A lifestyle is something by which you base every doctrine and value by which you LIVE. If people really, honestly did that with Japanese animation, they’d either be dead or in prison. Or committed to an ASYLUM. Just because you can deck yourself, your residence, and your DVD & CD shelves head-to-toe in overpriced crap does not make it a “lifestyle.” That just makes it a really expensive and really gaudy hobby.
But yeah, the unfortunate thing is that anime is really, truly fucked for its fanbase. The hardcore fans veer into this zealo–er–”pride” thing which they think gives them an excuse to throw their hobby at EVERYONE they see and play a victim when it doesn’t stick. The casual fans are the airheaded kind who watch with some base, juvenile motivation of seeing as much blood and guts and sex and ninja action as possible. All that’s left are people that waded through one hell or the other and had the maturity and intelligence to GROW OUT OF IT with time and age and gain some perspective. And those are few & far between.
Mmmmm I believe this line sums it all up.
“run around screaming BANKAI and RASENGAN, they’re the ones who are the most proud and ~coincidentally~ the ones that make us all look like loser fucks.”
I watch alot of anime, but i sure don’t bring it up unless i see someone of equal otaku-ness.
Talking about anime to every passing guy you meet only lowers your social image, cause most people don’t think too well of anime, believing that cartoons are only for kids below 12.
Spot on in a lot of ways, but did it ever occur to you as a chicken:egg dilemma? That being, is it overbearing losers that give otaku a bad name or is otakudom a natural attractor for losers to begin with. And are we (myself included) all just trying to distance ourselves from them – lest anyone associate us with a group that includes a large and vociferous demographic of loser types?
Either way, this article and your header graphic have made me want to read more. Nice one.
(And BTW, your BF is lucky to have you call him oniichan!)
@super rats: Yeah, probably. I have to admit, being a young woman, I tend to be a little more careful around older men. But I guess I’m not too discriminating, since I generally only apply that to the 40+ crowd, haha.
@Rogie: Right now, I’m living in metro Atlanta, Georgia (in the southern United States). I have to say, I don’t necessarily get ambushed every time I’m at the book store, but 4/5 times there’s some annoying otaku making a scene. ;_;
I didn’t consider that, but you’re completely right. If you spend all your time focused on one thing, I’d think that you’d definitely regret not experimenting and expanding your interests as you grow older and look back. But perhaps that’s a fit punishment for being a lunatic? :3
Yes! Seriously, get to know some of the crazies! They’re great fun to troll and/or to practice sarcasm on, especially with how clingy a lot of them are. And I would love you FOREVER if you did any ~interview conducting~!
@TheBigN: Bah, don’t feel sorry for me, I’ve dealt with all predatory otaku accordingly. In fact, I almost think of it as a sport, haha.
@David: I’d love to go to a purikura.~ Seeing cosplayers in a place like that wouldn’t really bother me too much. In fact, animufaggotry doesn’t bother me too much unless it’s at a book store, where I expect people to act with some kind of respect for the other people around them.
And YES, common sense! These animepride people just don’t seem to have much/any of it.
@Nyx: TELL IT LIKE IT IS, MY MAN! The area I live in has a lot of affluent Christian people, which I’m thinking accounts for most of the dumb fans (no offense to Christians, but read on for my reasoning). I think a lot of the girls especially are introduced to yaoi and think it’s ~forbidden~ and ~taboo~ and ~sinful~ and their way of rebelling… or they think that looking at mansex makes them different or special or something stupid like that because of their inexperience. Same with the greasy male fans, but they’re more in the “JAPAN IS SUPERIOR!!!” crowd for similar reasons that the chicks like yaoi.
I have to agree, JRock fans are something else. Personally, JRock isn’t really my thing, but I know when I had a passing interest in it a few years ago, the fans were just… HORRIFYING.
Although I tend to be apprehensive of both JRock and yaoi fans at first, seriously, I have many friends that like JRock and yaoi. And I feel bad for them, since they do get a bad name because of all the idiots out there.
I guess us normals just have to stick together. ;__;
@Nagi: “Just because you can deck yourself, your residence, and your DVD & CD shelves head-to-toe in overpriced crap does not make it a ‘lifestyle.’ That just makes it a really expensive and really gaudy hobby.” YES. YES YES YES.
“All that’s left are people that waded through one hell or the other and had the maturity and intelligence to GROW OUT OF IT with time and age and gain some perspective. And those are few & far between.” YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES!
@homeless_homo: Haha, indeed!
@§oL: Exactly. We know that anime IS cartoons and that it’s not the same as, say, Looney Toons. The average person DOESN’T know that Japanese cartoons =/= Looney Toons, and they’ll always look at you funny like you’re some kind of retard.
@kaizen: Actually, I did consider that, and I do believe that the whole hobby attracts loser/reject-types. I do consider myself a loser, but I’m perfectly alright with my kinda loser. And since my kinda loser is different from the obnoxious, out-of-control losers, I think it’s unfair to be looked upon as one of the ‘bad’ losers, so to speak. At least, that’s the way I see it.
Thanks, and I hope you like what you read/see/allthatgoodstuff! :3
(Haha, and in turn, I’m lucky to have him call me imoutochan >w<)
@kaizen
“(And BTW, your BF is lucky to have you call him oniichan!)”
You’re darn right I am!~<3
I’m glad you think so, oniichan!~<3
@Nagi
“Just because you can deck yourself, your residence, and your DVD & CD shelves head-to-toe in overpriced crap does not make it a “lifestyle.” That just makes it a really expensive and really gaudy hobby.”
Gaudy? :(
@Neggo
Well, for every finely-crafted Taka Tony figure and classy Yoshitoshi ABe wallscroll, there are dozens of cheap, Chinese Saber figures and horrid Gravitation wallscrolls with a badly-posed character against a 2-second Photoshop LENSFLARE. Not everyone has tastes as picky as ours. :P
I like your fiery spirit, must add you to my blog roll!
:O I am honored, Hinano! PLEASE REGARD ME KINDLY!
I can really agree you on the points you bring up. The thing is everyone bases their judgments on what ever they have experienced. Being in Singapore, our society attaches stereotypes to various schools and institutions so for example all boys from this school must be arrogant and snobbish. Knowing some chaps from that school made me realize the folly of my ways. Thing is the mode of communication called “word-of-mouth” drills the concept and idea into your mind more than you realize and from then on you believe in it till someone knocks some sense into your head.
In the end, its always the one bad apple that makes the whole bushel seem rotten even though the rest are still pretty fine. Though as i speak, the number of bad apples is increasing.
Nevertheless, the anime community worldwide( or at least part of it) thanks you for voicing your views and coming up with an excellent prose.